tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post9069231839481984144..comments2024-03-27T11:43:33.889-04:00Comments on Stapleton Kearns: Two questions answered followed by some unattractive snarlingStapleton Kearnshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00226409516935208164noreply@blogger.comBlogger46125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-13085204982353347782011-11-14T18:07:37.729-05:002011-11-14T18:07:37.729-05:00Art is the craft of deception
http://insomnia.ac/...Art is the craft of deception<br /><br />http://insomnia.ac/commentary/on_the_genealogy_of_art_games/lobotehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08619777624191089376noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-41213204295970970222011-11-08T11:34:26.891-05:002011-11-08T11:34:26.891-05:00The reason defining art gets so thorny is the agen...The reason defining art gets so thorny is the agenda behind it. The two most common reasons for debating this are 1.) to elevate something to a higher status (vanity) and 2.) delineating differences, in the interest of clearer language (anal retentive + vanity).<br /><br />Both of these reasons are well intentioned, but secondary to what's important in art, and they can be problematic. If art is made just to be aesthetic, what does that exclude and what does it include? Gardens are purely aesthetic. Are they a form of sculpture? What if a garden is rented out for parties? Is it no longer art? And, what about illustration? Does the Mona Lisa cease being art if it's used in an ad? And is it possible to create something that is only aesthetic, and nothing else? What if a painting was really just meant to get the artist into the model's pants? And how would we know? How many paintings were just practice, or to pay the bills? How do you determine which function was primary - the poverty of the artist vs. the need to express herself? What about artists who were forced to create, like Michelangelo and the Sistine Chapel?<br /><br />Here’s another problem. Drawings, paintings, and sculpture are works of art, but they also require craft (without getting into the post modern debate). So how do you define the craft that goes into painting vs. the craft that went in designing a cup, or the waterways and plumbing of an ancient city, which each aquaduct, pipe, spout, and pool was elaborately carved? They all contain craft, but the art contains something else? Seeing the spirit or soul in an artwork is an act of the viewer. It’s not arbitrary, but neither is it concrete. Another viewer might see the same soul in an everyday, handmade object. Art is as much in the eye of the viewer as in the object itself. Does an artwork exist if there’s no one there to see it?<br /><br /> I think you'll all agree there are levels of craft - the ancient, handmade ceramics of Mayan and Aztec cultures are worlds apart from the mass produced dishes found in Walmart. So, do they really fit in the same category? Calling this work craft is fine, if you like to distinguish your language as such - and this is important in writing about art. Every artist and historian should carefully choose and define their terms for clarity. But, that one definition shouldn't be forced on everyone because it won’t always fit. Some words have concrete definitions and some don't. We all know what a shoe is. There's little creative license. But words like god, religion, freedom, democracy, art, cake, etc, are fluid, they take on many forms. Check a dictionary and you'll find these words have many definitions – and that art and craft are often synonymous. The great thing about art is we all get to create our own definition, and that's what leads to so much variety (thank God). That high school art teacher wasn't wrong, he was merely teaching a different approach.<br /><br />Meanwhile, what's the fundamental importance of art? To quote the film Stranger Than Fiction, "it saves us." Art's what we do because we can't help it. It's a human response to an inhuman world. It takes many forms and might be infused with common items, decoratively, or otherwise. But that’s just my opinion – go find yours.T Arthur Smithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07831844692245441302noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-34814412330261700412011-11-07T12:32:22.433-05:002011-11-07T12:32:22.433-05:00These comments have gone on for many days since St...These comments have gone on for many days since Stape's post, so since I was the first maybe I'll be the last. Lots of good opinions here, but as for starting painting later in life, I interpret that Stape ultimately meant you can never be as good as you can possibly be starting late. In other words, you will never catch up with yourself, the self that strives to change and improve always. This year I have grown so much from my feeble starts, can I dare assume this learning curve would carry over all the years I would already have been painting?<br /><br />In Karate class a legendary old Japanese Sensei (teacher) said once 'Over all the years, keep training, keep training and you will always improve. Every day you will improve, and then you die'.<br />Oh well, you can't have everything; Stape, you're the best!Judy P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/09176284042670900772noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-6539031883050538392011-11-04T13:22:59.958-04:002011-11-04T13:22:59.958-04:00'I like em fine, and well enough not to jive e...'I like em fine, and well enough not to jive em about what their chances are of achieving mastery and competing with those who have done nothing else all their lives.'<br /><br />I have to admit, I've also always found this viewpoint kind of silly. There are, to me, two interesting points here. <br /><br />First, though it makes people uncomfortable to admit it in this PC world, people are not created equally. A person's success in any field is a combination of multiple things: effort, circumstance and innate ability. There are some people who will paint their whole lives but still produce mediocre work; yes, the time they have put in allows them to reach their full potential, but their innate ability limits their potential from the get-go. Then there are the Vermeers of the world, who live half a lifetime by today's standards, produce a limited quantity or work at a very slow pace, and yet each piece is lovely. Yes, Vermeer likely had intensive training for a short period, but he also had a large number of children and worked slowly (if art historians are to be believed on this count), suggesting that he didn't put in today's equivalent of a full career to obtain his mastery. He combined an inborn capacity for visual art with classical training and voila, beauty. To say that a painter who starts late in life will never, under any circumstances, acheive the same degree of mastery as one who paints for the duration of a career is to imtimate that you're capable of assessing a person's innate abilities without ever meeting them. (Full disclosure: I'm a woman in my thirties, working full time in a professional capacity, who is learning to paint in my limited free time. Perhaps this makes me biased.) <br /><br />Second, each person is invested in their beliefs for some emotional or psychological reason, I think. Meaning, people believe things because it benefits them in some way to believe them. To wit, I can see how it might be depressing as a professional artist to contemplate the fact that time spent doesn't necessarily guarantee you mastery per se. So I humbly submit, Stape, (this is not intended as a personal jab, I like your work fine) that you are invested in this belief because of the sacrifices you have endured to pursue your own career. Just something to think about.<br /><br />This is not to say that I don't see the value of time spent when learning an activity, I don't think that anybody could deny it. However, I don't believe that there is any formula for how much time is necessary to obtain mastery, in art or anything else.KFitzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15662297472741747227noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-42313213837980327122011-11-03T17:09:47.549-04:002011-11-03T17:09:47.549-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-60031593220537553222011-11-02T05:22:30.060-04:002011-11-02T05:22:30.060-04:00Hair Care Product
Hi Stapleton, Interesting webs...<a href="http://www.hairproductoutlet.com/" rel="nofollow">Hair Care Product</a><br /><br /><br />Hi Stapleton, Interesting website, i read it but i still have a few questions. shoot me an email and we will talk more becasue i may have an interesting idea for you.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-60865564036990366392011-11-01T22:48:45.671-04:002011-11-01T22:48:45.671-04:00Why does it matter?Why does it matter?Sue Harrellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09331476269238169228noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-27443451629446142262011-11-01T22:34:14.061-04:002011-11-01T22:34:14.061-04:00Thanks for my evening entertainment..you are funny...Thanks for my evening entertainment..you are funny and interestingPage Pearson Railsbackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15835062945787175006noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-86434245683430818132011-10-31T23:04:31.994-04:002011-10-31T23:04:31.994-04:00A well designed plumbing system is not art. It'...A well designed plumbing system is not art. It's a plumbing system.jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03014751431677271423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-31103006751077485912011-10-31T17:55:18.935-04:002011-10-31T17:55:18.935-04:00One problem it seems to me is that people here are...One problem it seems to me is that people here are making the judgement that calling something "art" makes it some how superior to "craft", when they are, in fact, equal in significance but different in function only.mariandioguardi.comhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16963944767715466681noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-70230496075949755642011-10-31T07:59:39.528-04:002011-10-31T07:59:39.528-04:00I am laughing my ARSE off at the guy who commented...I am laughing my ARSE off at the guy who commented that the dictionary definition of a word is not really it's meaning....too funny! I guess I know where he stands on a whole host of current issues...LOLOLOLOL!Robert J. Simonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06799208093956328662noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-68280996115118963252011-10-30T11:51:26.904-04:002011-10-30T11:51:26.904-04:00I happened to be at the start of this trail of com...I happened to be at the start of this trail of comments, and they are all interesting, with lots of good points.<br />That question "what is art?" is one I never want to go near, but lately it's become a wad of gum on my shoe.<br />A relative creates abstract art that consists of cutting out magazine images, or comics, and glues or weaves them together, and frankly is quite haughty about it. He has an art degree from the time where self-expression was all the rage, so I suppose that's where he gets it from. I can't get over that there is not one originally created line, or image anywhere. I am politely quiet about it, other than the 'good luck with your showing' when his art group has an exhibition.<br />I know I'm safe writing about it here, because he would never read this blog- he says he knows it all already! If I'm being mean-spirited someone please let me know, I can take it!Judy P.https://www.blogger.com/profile/09176284042670900772noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-90547437815702374722011-10-29T21:56:44.641-04:002011-10-29T21:56:44.641-04:00Black and white is great, but it's the gray ar...Black and white is great, but it's the gray areas that are the most interesting to me.....Barbara Carrhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14621181463907636474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-51975324870026289322011-10-29T17:57:23.539-04:002011-10-29T17:57:23.539-04:00Here's the art educator in me posting. The dif...Here's the art educator in me posting. The difference between art and craft: This is an aesthetic question that will never totally be answered which is good for discussion and leaving open ended responses. After all, the arts are about critical thinking and problem solving. Just because we put early Native American pottery in a museum does not make it "art" as we define it. It was created as a functional item in their culture. We can admire the handiwork, but it was not created to be admired or create an emotional response.Durinda Cheek, Fine Artisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04419537093540606442noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-69092847856530571402011-10-28T22:30:33.081-04:002011-10-28T22:30:33.081-04:00You might get an argument about those extra fancy ...You might get an argument about those extra fancy glass paperweights.willekhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05626541339963605016noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-40693750968989228032011-10-28T19:37:52.103-04:002011-10-28T19:37:52.103-04:00After reading others comments (all valid) I see a ...After reading others comments (all valid) I see a definition like this as a starting point, much like any set of rules. <br />There will always be exceptions and rules can be broken. But we must first start with a basic definition for the purpose of discussion.<br /><br />As I said in earlier comment, architectural design and engineering really must go hand in hand, simultaneously, but for discussion can be separated.<br /><br />I would argue that art and craft are the same (with grey areas). You have to start somewhere.<br /><br />Are designers making art? Does the auto designer qualify as an artist? Of course. Hang his/her design on a wall. Both definitions have been fulfilled.David Teterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16747334525619423349noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-39433965382971311482011-10-28T11:27:25.548-04:002011-10-28T11:27:25.548-04:00I know so many people that have painted all of the...I know so many people that have painted all of their lives and they are still just shit painters. Dennis Miller Bunker died at the very young age of 29, I like his work, but is the reason that he is in so many museums and so highly valued about his talent or his pedigree?...and one more question in reference to the ageism thing, there is always that 10,000 hour theory. What does it matter if the 10,000 hours are towards the younger years or older years?Luanne Meaderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15677762600509185167noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-18658460292166378642011-10-28T10:57:21.730-04:002011-10-28T10:57:21.730-04:00Looks like I screwed up that link (not surprised) ...Looks like I screwed up that link (not surprised) <br /><br />It's:<br /><br />http://illustrationfixation.blogspot.com/2011/05/seeing-big-picture.html<br /><br />-ChrisChris Beatricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02801244582928889372noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-59382314139198811042011-10-28T10:55:25.813-04:002011-10-28T10:55:25.813-04:00Re learning to paint loosely & using photos: o...Re learning to paint loosely & using photos: one *exercise* (emphasis that this is an EXERCISE not a way to make paintings), is to take a digital photo and blur it in Photoshop to the point of barely being able to recognize elements, then paint that (sort of a mass of color/value blobs). This is similar to squinting, but more extreme. Also you can back off from it, that is, once you paint the fully blurred version, do a version with less blur, and paint on top of your original. For some of us this can result in a huge shift in how we see. Again, it's not a method for making paintings, but it can incite a sort of awakening of some dormant sensibilities.<br /> <br />Here's a post on my horribly neglected blog about this:<br /><br /><a rel="nofollow">Seeing the Big Picture</a>Chris Beatricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02801244582928889372noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-23960894277916461692011-10-28T10:53:30.466-04:002011-10-28T10:53:30.466-04:00Well, true enough, but there are some hybrids and ...Well, true enough, but there are some hybrids and gray areas out there. For example, illustration serves a purpose (like a sink), in that it communicates a specific, often detailed idea - but it also exists largely to be "beautiful" (a simplistic term, but I get your meaning). Great cuisine is also art, but at the same time it feeds us. It's easy to draw a distinction between "pure painting" (i.e. what you do, which is wonderful) and plumbing... but a lot of the world exists between those two extremes.Chris Beatricehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02801244582928889372noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-2996857199213019492011-10-28T02:38:50.383-04:002011-10-28T02:38:50.383-04:00I'm just leaving this comment because I couldn...I'm just leaving this comment because I couldn't find the "LIKE" button on here...Dot Coursonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00480008607594406482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-19018933704695653322011-10-27T20:03:06.149-04:002011-10-27T20:03:06.149-04:00This is called making waves where there are none.This is called making waves where there are none.clarkolahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12741406599938501082noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-35060296852582985402011-10-27T09:55:55.279-04:002011-10-27T09:55:55.279-04:00I've been struggling with defining art and cra...I've been struggling with defining art and craft and it's difficult to put into words clearly. Thanks for the definition.<br />I was thinking it was the difference between whether people highly value it and hang it on a prominent wall, or put it in the bathroom. I know I have decorated many fine bathrooms.<br />I like your definition better.Bradhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04698921469217993862noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-50466893443456002072011-10-27T08:53:10.951-04:002011-10-27T08:53:10.951-04:00Doesn't the FACT that this dialogue, this deba...Doesn't the FACT that this dialogue, this debate, about the NATURE of art, that has raged for centuries (hasn't it?) imply something significant to everyone here? To me it either suggests that there IS no clear definition, or that we RESIST the correct answer. I find it highly SIGNIFICANT that on every blog I've encountered, every discussion I've had since college, we can't come to an agreement on the questions: WHAT IS ART? Stapleton has chosen his definition, and is comfortable with it. I wonder, however, why the rest of us have such a hard time distinguishing between craft and art, low art and high art, fine art and not-so-fine-art, etc.?Sescohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01857017166141673658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5682081471599286551.post-18031412430748161292011-10-26T23:07:50.318-04:002011-10-26T23:07:50.318-04:00Art is about human intent, process, purposeful cre...Art is about human intent, process, purposeful creation. A mathemetician who solves the world's problems with the most beautiful equation is an artist. A musician who learns to deliver the most heart wrenching aria to your ears is an artist, not coincidentally, so is the maker of their instrument. A log in the forest is not art. A painted log is art. A plumbing system, intuitevly designed and based upon logs is art.<br /><br />I hope artists can appreciate the human nature of other people's work, and the time it takes to achieve something miraculous through intent study and design.<br /><br />But there is nothing more true to art than to create something solely for the purpose of enjoying its human creation.climber-manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08978529691991590768noreply@blogger.com